Breakpoint vs. The Gathering 2003: Which party had the better releases?

alain / division zero:
Breakpoint for sure.

Anaki Muon:
I don't know, I haven't checked any of them out yet.

delta\\bypass:
probably breakpoint

DiamonDie / foobug^Numedia Cyclops:
Breakpoint. Absolutely.

gloom / excess:
Breakpoint, without a doubt. :) But if you look at the track-record for the previous three-four years of TG, this year proved that the Norwegian scene is at a serious upswing - if only we could get some more foreign visitors, but with Breakpoint being held at the exact same time.. creative suggestions are welcome. :)

hazey:
Breakpoint

iliks / hugi:
Haven't watched

iTeC / crAss:
BP

kusma / excess:
Breakpoint. By far.

mados / TAP:
Didn't see the Gathering releases yet. But I think Breakpoint was better.

maali^bohemiq:
Breakpoint

malken / granma:
Breakpoint

myst^e2:
I don't know...

nosfe / mfx:
breakpoint

Oyiseer of aardbei:
Breakpoint!

Pantaloon / Fairlight:
Breakpoint

Paralax / Speckdrumm:
Breakpoint 2003

Reload / .au:
breakpoint for sure
best party releases was at State of the art party 02.

riskej / oca / [v]arga:
the gathering

ritz [nd-44-zh]:
haven't been at the gathering, but the first places from the PC demo, 64k and 4k were just AWESOME .. [the other releases varied from good, okay-ish to lame and stuff like "yeah, we all know you can fit *that* in 64k"]
from the 64k both project genesis and the farbrausch intro were extremely well done.. genesis because it had lots and lots of stuff in 64k [i didn't like the music] and fr because the music rocked, and the 3d girl looked excellent.

rokus:
didn't see the gathering releases, but bp was amazing, especially the 4k demos and the amiga.

seven11 / k-storm:
i am of the opinion that breakpoint had the better releases and a higher quantity of releases as well.
i was not there but i plan to walk to BP2004 next year ;-)
FARBrausch rules .......... hehe

snq / aardbei:
Breakpoint.

sprocket / razor 1911:
Breakpoint, of course.. Did you see the gfx compo at TG? Hehehe, pretty bad..

sultasan^pht:
breakpoint

Unlock / Vantage / Padua:
Definitivley, Breakpoint had the better releases. And Breakpoint was the true scene party - still I respect the efforts of some guys in the TG organizing bringing TG back to scene minds. But please, guys, chose a different date. Easter is reserved for Breakpoint.

unseen fate^dawning:
breakpoint

Valzihjken . Freshlint:
Dunno. Didn't see.

What do you think about demos made with Macromedia Flash?

alain / division zero:
Not my cup of tea. Could be interesting, but in my sense it's not scene related.

Anaki Muon:
I think they're pretty cool. The whole point of the demoscene is to use new media and platforms for creating artistic and creative works on computer and computer-based platforms, so it seems to me as though Flash is a medium that fits in to the demoscene rather nicely. Unfortunately it also seems to me as though the most innovative and artistic work with Flash is being put forth by individuals who are in no way affiliated with the demoscene and are quite possibly not even interested in it.

bmpc:
I have no problem with them, if the animation and sound have good quality. I'll "judge" it for what it's worth and not for the tools used to do them.
I actually rather see Flash used properly in a demo than Flash badly used in webpages. Flash is a little hyped and "everyone" is doing webpages in Flash. No problem with that, but a lot of these sites would be better without the flash.

delta\\bypass:
erm. flash is nice. but since I'm a coder, I think of flash as a designer's tool, which makes it impossible to do "real" demos with coded effects in flash. (Yeah, I know you can code flash too, but the feeling stays the same for me.)
There are in fact lots of flash-animations I realy like, only thing I wouldn't call them demos.

DiamonDie / foobug^Numedia Cyclops:
Some of them are good, but I don't really know if they count as demos. Sometimes it's really hard to tell. Assembly has had some very good Flash releases. This year they also allow Alambik entries, which is good as I think Alambik is better than Flash and deserves more attention.

gloom / excess:
Personally I don't really think of anything not being able to run as an executable on its own qualifies as a demo. In my world, the demos are those that are located in a directory with demo.exe and demo.dat - preferably running under DOS or AmigaOS. :)

hazey:
Deserve a special category as they are harder to judge. More weight should be put on design and originality whilst judging such Flash-demos.

iliks / hugi:
They're slow

iTeC / crAss:
Are they called demos ?

kusma / excess:
Flash has nothing to do with demos.

mados / TAP:
Ok for faaast and wild compos. Sucks in all other compos.

maali^bohemiq:
They suck megahard

malken / granma:
Since I don't know any flash at all I cannot judge them. Usually I don't even watch them.

myst^e2:
Big shit!

nosfe / mfx:
sux0r.

Oyiseer of aardbei:
no, i really dont like that. i think the people making flash and good flash stuff are really great but it really doesnt belong to the demoscene.

Pantaloon / Fairlight:
Booring

Paralax / Speckdrumm:
They are irrelevant to me. As of now it's not possible to do really great stuff and when it'll be possible to do so, it will be just lame :)

Reload / .au:
hmmmm.....

riskej / oca / [v]arga:
i think that it is good

ritz [nd-44-zh]:
would be nice, but a good demo would need a fast hard big machine to run properly, i'm afraid.
i think their place is in the wild-compos [no separate compo]
about wild compos, i think every wild entry should show an explanation about how the thing was made etc a few [readable] seconds before it starts.. there is already place for this on most submission sheets, but i think it should be encouraged and emphasized more.

rokus:
demos should be written in a common language. demos in flash can't provide such effects like other ones. the creativity and the spectrum of possibilities is limited to the options the macromedia (and swish ...) guys implement in their software...

snq / aardbei:
Nonsense :)

sprocket / razor 1911:
I enjoy them as much as I enjoy flash animations, if they are well-made. Some types of demo design can look good in flash, I guess.

sultasan^pht:
sux

Tolle:
When you surf to a commercial site, you are often greeted with an 'intro' flash animation, and they all have the same 'look and feel'. scrolled/zoomed images with transparent scrolled/zoomed text.
When you watch a flash 'demo' you experience that same 'look and feel', there seem to be few people that want to do innovative, interesting, wonderful things on this platform.
Up until now, I have not watched a single flash demo that has not been boring.
In my opinion a good demo should have a 'wow' feel to it. Something that makes it better than the 'average' demo. with regular pc/amiga/... demos, every once in a while some group makes a demo with new 'amazing' effects/design/ideas, and some releases on the next big party try to mimic them. (sometimes surpassing, but often just worse than the original)
Currently flash has a great potential; since almost every flash demo looks just the same, it couldn't be that hard for anyone to do something new and exciting with it.
So, I guess that the platform is interesting, but the stuff released on it isn't (yet?)

Unlock / Vantage / Padua:
Another kind of demos.. They might be okay if done with Flash scripting, but often they simply look butt-cheap. Still, people might be able to do nice things with Flash. Better to use something like Alambik though.

unseen fate^dawning:
i dont like them, i dont even consider them demos

Valzihjken . Freshlint:
Yuck. Okay, they can be decent. Okay, I want real demos.

Are diskmags still worth reading these days?

alain / division zero:
Yes, sure, they are part of the scene spirit.

Anaki Muon:
Most certainly.

delta\\bypass:
Like every printed magazine, there are good and bad issues. So, taking a look is always a option.

DiamonDie / foobug^Numedia Cyclops:
Yes. Even though the quantity has decreased, the quality has not. People just seem to be lazy about writing.

gloom / excess:
Yes, they are - it's just too bad that most people don't take their time with them.

hazey:
Diskmags are still worth reading these days. They provide a large array of articles on various topics. And are a blessing to those who are unable to scurry the internet for worthwhile reading material. :)

iliks / hugi:
Probably - but they should have more content of philosophical nature instead of resembling "news sites"

iTeC / crAss:
Surely!

kusma / excess:
Absolutely

mados / TAP:
Sure.

maali^bohemiq:
hardly... Pain is still reasonable tho

malken / granma:
HUGI!

myst^e2:
Yes! Yes!! YES!!!

nosfe / mfx:
sure!

Oyiseer of aardbei:
yep, but i think an online based magazine would be even better.

Pantaloon / Fairlight:
Hell yes

Paralax / Speckdrumm:
yes. They are also a motivation for sceners to write articles they'd otherwise never have written. I also like the feeling of consuming some fine piece of diskmag mixed with chiptunes.

Reload / .au:
yes

riskej / oca / [v]arga:
yes

ritz [nd-44-zh]:
don't know, i haven't really been scening much lately, except for visiting breakpoint.

rokus:
of course. if the daily visit on pouet or ojuice is like the daily news on tv, diskmags are like the newspaper. the news might be a bit outdated and some other things which live from their up-to-dateness aren't suited for diskmags, but all those tutorials, those long debates and reports, funny stories, poems, .... would be boring on a conventional website.

snq / aardbei:
Sometimes... I find most of the non coding related content uninteresting tho. I read every Hugi and Pain issue, but mostly end up being disappointed. I also think mags are getting too big. I'm on modem again :)

sprocket / razor 1911:
Yes, definitely!
Not as much as in the early 90s, but still interesting.

sultasan^pht:
sure otherwise i wouldn't fill this nicey-nice form

Tolle:
Of course!
Diskmags have a whole different feel to them than webbrowsing. Reading the articles in Hugi online just isn't the same as downloading and running the real thing.

Unlock / Vantage / Padua:
Depends on the diskmag ;-)

unseen fate^dawning:
yes, because pain;D

Valzihjken . Freshlint:
YES!

Which was the best article in Hugi 26?

alain / division zero:
"Party time" articles

Anaki Muon:
I haven't read it yet... I'm on my way to do that now... I suppose I should have filled out this support form after I read it.

DiamonDie / foobug^Numedia Cyclops:
Can't remember.

gloom / excess:
Haven't read it yet.

hazey:
I've read it, yet atm (behind a university terminal) it's hard to pinpoint the best article. I must say I enjoyed the music tutorials the most.

iliks / hugi:
Thoughts

kusma / excess:
Didn't read them all. But "Behind the magic - generating 3d worlds from scratch".

maali^bohemiq:
can't recall

mados / TAP:
My absolutely favourite article in Hugi #26: "hugi 26 - coding corner graphics hopper making a 64k intro.htm".

malken / granma:
All articles in the Coders Corner

myst^e2:
There isn\'t such an article.

Oyiseer of aardbei:
no idea

Pantaloon / Fairlight:
Can't remember the articles

riskej / oca / [v]arga:
hmm... hard question :))

ritz [nd-44-zh]:
i can't remember if i've read it :)

rokus:
i like the coding tuts and the poems.

snq / aardbei:
Generating 3d worlds from scratch.
Making a 64k intro was interesting as well.

sprocket / razor 1911:
I don't remember. I didn't like the issue as a whole..

sultasan^pht:
i did read the issue but i can't remember... real life section is interesting tho. and the story of the selfdestructive girl too.

Tolle:
I personally liked the opengl with assembly in 4k article.

unseen fate^dawning:
i dont remember anymore

Valzihjken . Freshlint:
I don't remember.

Which topics would you like to read about in next Hugi?

alain / division zero:
demo reviews and interviews

Anaki Muon:
- How to get involved in the demoscene.
- Different media used within the demoscene (with in-depth explanations of the various media).
- various other how-to's (such as "How to Get Involved in the Sega Dreamcast Demoscene" or "Basics of Tracking" and stuff like that).

bmpc:
PHP, ASP, other internet technologies
The future of the internet
The missuage of Flash on websites

delta\\bypass:
coding and maths, all I can get. No beginners stuff, though.

DiamonDie / foobug^Numedia Cyclops:
Hmm. There's one thing that could be worth noting: it seems some compos are going extinct. ASCII/ANSI and 4k compos have been rare for a while, but now also raytrace compos are endangered. Even Assembly dropped raytraced graphics in favor of drawn, freestyle and fast graphics. Simulaatio had a 3d compo, but there was only one entry.
Maybe also something about party pictures/Slengpung? And good graphics tutorials.

gloom / excess:
How to get the sceners to support former great scene-parties :)

hazey:
Some articles on outreaches of the demoscene would be nice. Or on the actual influence of (past) demoscene on the (current) IT sector. Articles about music are always welcome. :p As well as articles on the demoscene of non-x86 platforms.

iliks / hugi:
More real life, more philosophical discussions, less demoscene

kusma / excess:
4k windows coding ;)

maali^bohemiq:
dunno, but just kick out that so called poetry, stories crap... i mean, some of it can be nice, but not claim 50% of the diskmag content with it

malken / granma:
About software synthesizers

myst^e2:
How to do basic demo effects (bumpmapping, moving shit, rotozooming, ...) in software in C. Preferably with algos.

Oyiseer of aardbei:
no idea

Pantaloon / Fairlight:
Gossip!!!

riskej / oca / [v]arga:
music reviews

ritz [nd-44-zh]:
* vocoding [the fr 64k]
* something about the winning 4k on breakpoint [like, the source with additional explanations]
* something to remind me again why i should write another 4k [i'm a bit bitter about this, getting respect from a hall full of nerds is pretty cool, but what is the use again?]
* alcohol abuse at parties

rokus:
not winamp-skinning.
this is very simple and does not belong to the traditional activities of sceners. of course i don't want to goof on it but the basics are very easy and "advanced winamp skinning" shouldn't find a place in a scenish diskmag.
more about my favourite os. linux is growing, especially in the scene. for example a tutorial about porting demos or writing demos portable...

snq / aardbei:
Coding. Much coding :)

sprocket / razor 1911:
Reviews of scene productions.
Graphics and music articles.
Scene news and rumours.
No real-world stuff, only scene.

sultasan^pht:
i would like to read that italian demoscene is not dead :)

Tolle:
Well I like the coding corner a lot, so the more articles in there, the better.

unseen fate^dawning:
booze and bukkake

Valzihjken . Freshlint:
I like interviews with great trackers. Also, I like reviews of demos and intros. Tracking tips are also great. (Hmm, guess who likes to track?)

Any news about yourself or your group you'd like to have published in Hugi?

gloom / excess:
Excess is working on a new demo, the first serious one since last year's Scene Event-success, "Shapeshifter". When it will be released is unsure, but this summer we -will- see another Excess-demo worth watching.
Excess, Spaceballs and Ephidrena are going to arrange another Solskogen this summer! Time and place is not quite decided yet, but last years success WILL be repeated - start cooling your beer and watch http://solskogen.demoscene.no/ for updates.

hazey:
Nope, well... at least not until we get our act together. :)

kusma / excess:
nope

mados / TAP:
TAP (will) get a new website, but that's not worth being published in Hugi.

maali^bohemiq:
no

nosfe / mfx:
A Finnish Amiga Group will dominate the scene in the year 2003.

Oyiseer of aardbei:
nop

Pantaloon / Fairlight:
Fairlight will soon release a lot of new productions, 3 demos (work in progress), Twisted Chipster 2 (work in progress - almost done), 64k Intro for assembly.

Paralax / Speckdrumm:
well.. nothing special. Our homepage http://www.speckdrumm.org has been finished and is now serving our demos and information for all foliba lovers out there :)

Reload / .au:
will travel to the assembly party all the way from Australia..
there will be a couple of us there..

riskej / oca / [v]arga:
no

ritz [nd-44-zh]:
no

seven11 / k-storm:
seven11 joins the k-storm group
we place 3rd at the sythesis party in france this year.
we are working on the next production which will be called "PROGRESS2"

snq / aardbei:
I'm back, maybe ;)

sprocket / razor 1911:
Razor news:
Mikl (gfx) left
Am (gfx) joined
Mustafa (gfx) joined
Spool (code) joined

sultasan^pht:
ask raver :>

Valzihjken . Freshlint:
Fresh Lint members think that we are nearly done with our first little musicdisk, called "Linty Fresh." We are, however, looking for guest releases and another member or two.

Anything else you'd like to get printed in Hugi?

Anaki Muon:
I wouldn't mind seeing an "Old Skool" issue. What do I mean by that?
- Ascii logo.
- Ascii pics.
- Ansi pics.
- RIP pics.
- Completely "hand-drawn" VGA pics (ie: lacking the use of graphic filters and what-not during the creative proccess).
- How the demoscene came to be.
- A best of Hugi section.
- Reviews of OLD demos on old systems, such as the C64 and the NES.
- Reviews of NEW demos on old systems, such as the C64 and the NES.
- List of top 50 groups in demoscene history and why.
- List of top 50 individuals in demoscene history and why.
- Reviews of the top 10 demoscene parties.
- Article on how demoscene music has influenced mainstream music (including rip-offs, genres and what-not).
- From the old skool BBS to the modern-day internet, from (floppy)diskmags to CD-Mags and DVD-mags, and what mediums may be used in the future for spreading the word on the demoscene.
- What the media and platforms may be used in the future or are just beginning to be used by the demoscene. Such as Flash, the GameBoy Advance, MP3, some new tracker format (.PSY?), various 3D media (such as .SVG), new programming languages, new BBS software, Blue-Ray Disc, etc.
- Some other stuff related to the old days, and where the new days are going.

bmpc:
I think it would be a good idea if some people could write about their countries' school system (HS and University), and how to apply for university in each country. Could be useful for people who are considering going to study abroad.

DiamonDie / foobug^Numedia Cyclops:
More short stories and party reports. I don't really care for the interviews, at least most of them, though the one about the DeviantART girl was interesting.

gloom / excess:
Nah, but you people are doing a great job - keep it up! :)

hazey:
Comics, though I can't see that happening. :D
[Editor's note: Well, as a matter of fact we do have some comics in this issue! Though I guess a really cool thing would be scene-related comics...! //Adok]

kusma / excess:
yaphan wear womens' throusers

mados / TAP:
Nope.

maali^bohemiq:
no

myst^e2:
Nothing special. Hugi rox! Stay cool! Stay alive!

Oyiseer of aardbei:
nop

Paralax / Speckdrumm:
as of now, nope, thx.

Reload / .au:
charts...

riskej / oca / [v]arga:
no :)

ritz [nd-44-zh]:
getting very drunk is not partying, alcohol abuse is NOT scene spirit

rokus:
the real party is outside.

seven11 / k-storm:
we are searching for talented members like
gfx , code , musician
get in touch with
l_skarab@hotmail.com
or visit our site at
www.kstorm.com.st

snq / aardbei:
Not really, no. Thanks anyway.

sultasan^pht:
nope

Valzihjken . Freshlint:
Yeah...